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SSS, what can we expect from it?

wilch23 · 250 · 47507

wilch23

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Since the SSS is in the front page now, maybe we should get a clearer picture of this SSS.

Mga In House Analysts, fire away!


wilch23

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Maybe we should understand our SSS more deeply so we can know what to expect from it.

Is the SSS a WELFARE fund or a PENSION FUND?
Is it private or govt?


bauer

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^ Quick figures

In GSIS annual report 2014, it paid claims and benefits of 88 BILLION PESOS.  GSIS has more than 1 million members in government service.  Civil service data 2009 or 2011 reported about 13,000 personnel separated from government.

In SSS annual report 2014, it paid claims and benefits of 120 BILLION PESOS.  SSS has more than 32 million members in private sector.  2 million pensioners as of 2015.

What can we see?  Government pensioners are OVERPAID compared to their counterparts in the private sector.

IRONICAL SITUATION ---- SSS employees whose "bosses" are private workers, in case, they retire, will receive their pensions thru GSIS.  Meaning, SSS employee retirees will receive SUPERIOR pensions compared to their 'bosses'. 

No wonder SSS employees do not care how to properly treat SSS pensioners. Only in the Philippines!


bajoyjoy

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^ Quick figures

In GSIS annual report 2014, it paid claims and benefits of 88 BILLION PESOS.  GSIS has more than 1 million members in government service.  Civil service data 2009 or 2011 reported about 13,000 personnel separated from government.

In SSS annual report 2014, it paid claims and benefits of 120 BILLION PESOS.  SSS has more than 32 million members in private sector.  2 million pensioners as of 2015.

What can we see?  Government pensioners are OVERPAID compared to their counterparts in the private sector.

IRONICAL SITUATION ---- SSS employees whose "bosses" are private workers, in case, they retire, will receive their pensions thru GSIS.  Meaning, SSS employee retirees will receive SUPERIOR pensions compared to their 'bosses'. 

No wonder SSS employees do not care how to properly treat SSS pensioners. Only in the Philippines!

bauer

employees' contribution in gsis is around 21% of salary per month, with sss its only 11%.

ave. pension from sss is around 3,500. for gsis pensioners, about 10k.

SSS Pensioners of today means they are above 60yrs old. Assuming they started working and contributing to sss at age 20 in year 1975, minimum wage at that time, can anybody guess? 8. As in eight pesos per day. times 22 days, 176 per month. asssuming sss contri is 10%, thats about P18 pesos per month contribution. and these same contributors i assume are the ones receiving the lowest rate of 1,200/mo right now. and what our brilliant legislators wanted was for atleast 2,000 increase. thats 160% increase for the lowest bracket. who only contributed P18 per month. tapos that part of the bill that's supposed to make provisions on where the fund will be sourced (contribution rate hike din), they scrapped. Nasaan naman ang logic jan. Puro lang pagpapa-pogi dahil mag-eeleksyon.

also, hindi lang sa sss paiyakan ang serbisyo, sa gsis din. kaya outrageous yung sinasabi mong overpaid ang govt employees. hindi nga ba tinatawanan ang sweldo ng mga ordinaryong govt employee?

the way that sss contribution was formulated is what i find as the real problem here, parang hindi na-price in nang tama ang inflation, ang wage hike, etc.. dapat habang tumataas ang mga yan, umaakyat din ang contribution rate. e sino ba unang umaalma pag mag increase ng contribution rate, mga employees din. dahil nga wala naman daw napapala sa sss.

As to the compensation received by sss employees, totoo naman mas malaki sila kumpara sa ibang ahensya ng gobyerno, ganun talaga pag may sariling charter ang agency. pero yung inilabas ng kampo ni neri colminares na salaries/benefits ng officials na around P2-4M+ ang nakukuha nila, haller, ANNUAL YUN. and haller, GROSS YUN. and haller, ikumpara nyo sa counterpart CEO/VPs nila sa private sector, baka bonus lang yan.wag kayong nagpapa-gatong ng basta-basta without scrutinizing the figures and all the angles.



bajoyjoy

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Sana ang tinitignan natin dito is yung kabuuang picture. financial illiteracy na naman ang punot-bunga ng problemang ito, ito dapat ang ipinagsisigawan natin sa iba na hindi taga-PMT and therefore di nakakaintindi ng saving for the future na mantra natin dito.

dun sa tanong ni wilch, ang sss hindi welfare fund, hindi dapat nakadepende sa sss ang buhay ng mga senior citizens kundi sa sarili nilang ipon at investments

 my biggest issue here is yung pinagdaanang proseso ng pagpasa ng bill, gumastos tayo ng pampasweldo ng taga-congress at senate. I very much agree dapat magtaas na ng pension pero ayusin nila ang proposals nila,yung makatotohanan naman. Pero dahil sa kanilang sloppy work, hindi inaral ang financial impact, hindi nagrecommend ng reasonableng increase at basta na lang nag-peg sa 2000 para maglaway ang mga matatanda at iboto sila sa eleksyon... napunta ang lahat ng ginastos/taxpayer's money, sa wala. Ewan ko bakit walang nanggagalaiti tungkol dito.

Naalala nyo yung political ad ni colminares around december of last year... binabandera na nya na sya ang author ng bill on sss pension hike. ahm sir, bill lang yan, hindi batas, wag kang ano. tuloy, napurnada, at bad-shot sya sa mga senior citizens na pinaasa nya. kaya out of desperation, nagpopropose naman na ioverturn daw ang veto through 2/3 majority vote. ayan na naman kayo, aksaya na naman ng govt resources with your mission impossible agenda.

Nakakapikon talaga minsan ang buhay sa pinas, pero sana tama ang rason at pinagbubuntunan natin ng pikon.



bauer

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bauer

employees' contribution in gsis is around 21% of salary per month, with sss its only 11%.

 


@bajoyjoy,

Let's break it down further.

GSIS - 9% employee share + 12% government share = 21%

SSS - 3.6% employee share + 7.5% company share = 11%

If this is the ONLY PARAMETER via percentage, your opinion is accurate indeed. SSS pensioners has nothing to compare because they are paying less.  BUT, this is not simply a case of percentages.  Why?

As per LAW for government employees - there is NO TOP RATE in salary bracket.  So if your salary gets higher, your pension will be higher as well (of course, the contribution is higher).   

Another injustice in computation of pension ---- Did you know that the computation of pension will be based on a retirees' last 3 YEARS in service?  Example,  if the government employee started at 5,000 pesos per month and then when he/she retires, his/her last salary for the past 3 years is 30,000 pesos per month, the pension will be based on 30k x a maximum of 90% so in effect, a government pensioner will receive 27,000 per month in pension.

In SSS LAW, there is a TOP RATE of 16,000 pesos.  It means, SSS contribution will not go beyond 1,790 pesos so that your pension when you are retiring, WILL BE MINISCULE compared to the LIVING EXPENSES. 

For example, private employee started on the same 5k per month in salary and upon retirement receives 30k per month in salary, his/her pension, upon retirement, will not be computed on the basis of his/her last 3 years monthly average salary BUT IT WILL BE ASSESSED BASED ON HIS/HER MONTHLY SALARY CREDITS FOR THE ENTIRE EMPLOYMENT YEARS.  Plus, it will be 20% ONLY of the MONTHLY SALARY CREDIT.  So if his AVERAGE MONTHLY CREDIT is 10,500 (5k+16k top rate=21/2) get the 20%, 2,100 pesos + 300 pesos = 2,400 pesos per month.

In other words, our existing LAWS are design to HELP government employees ACHIEVE A LIVING PENSION STANDARD after retirement while private employees are design just to provide BELOW LIVING PENSION STANDARD.  Where's fairness in this set-up?

Look at this percentage instead,

GSIS can receive at least 90% of their average monthly basic salary for the LAST 3 YEARS IN SERVICE.

SSS can receive MAXIMUM of 20% of the average monthly salary CREDITS for the ENTIRE YEARS IN EMPLOYMENT.

By LAWS, Government service receives SUPERIOR PENSION BENEFITS.  Who is paying for it? of course, it is US, being the TAX PAYERS.

In SSS, premiums were not raised NOT BECAUSE EMPLOYEES WILL COMPLAIN, IT IS BECAUSE THE EMPLOYERS WILL COMPLAIN MORE.  Our government is protecting the interest of Business OWNERS.  Not its workers.


bauer

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ave. pension from sss is around 3,500. for gsis pensioners, about 10k.

 

Let's stick to math,  Based on GSIS annual report for the year 2014, 88 BILLION PESOS paid on claims and benefits. 

If you say GSIS pensioners average monthly pension is 10k, it MAY MEAN there are now more than 700,000 people receiving pensions in government.  it is about 50% of total government employees of about 1.5 million.  Something is terribly wrong SCIENCE-wise.  It is either people are LIVING LONGER IN OLD AGE OR AVERAGE PENSION IS REALLY MORE THAN 10k per month. 

In government, it MIGHT BE 2 working for every 1 pensioner. VERY UNLIKELY.

Compare to SSS --- 33 million members with 2 million pensioners (less than 10% receives a person).  15 working for every 1 pensioner.


TulogSaPancitan

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my biggest issue here is yung pinagdaanang proseso ng pagpasa ng bill, gumastos tayo ng pampasweldo ng taga-congress at senate. I very much agree dapat magtaas na ng pension pero ayusin nila ang proposals nila,yung makatotohanan naman. Pero dahil sa kanilang sloppy work, hindi inaral ang financial impact, hindi nagrecommend ng reasonableng increase at basta na lang nag-peg sa 2000 para maglaway ang mga matatanda at iboto sila sa eleksyon... napunta ang lahat ng ginastos/taxpayer's money, sa wala. Ewan ko bakit walang nanggagalaiti tungkol dito.


i am pissed. im so pissed that if i met that scum in a mall, i will punch him as hard as i can (hopefully un guarded ehehe).

let’s face it, many are freeloaders. the poor has entitlement issues. the middle class is being squeezed every penny they got. the rich can always depend on tax avoidance lawyers.

increase in benefits without consequent increase in contribution is wishful delusion. yes 2k increase will have an overwhelming benefit especially to the poorest among us but that will kill also the fund unless contribution is increased.

i don’t like the idea that congress has power to give away private people personal money (sss). that’s like mandating the bank to give certain group of people free money. 

i stopped my sss contribution first chance i went abroad. not worth my time and worry. besides based on my calculation what will i get for pension is enuf only to buy me a week’s meal at best. but i worry for everyone’s sake that the fund will die in the wrong hands earlier that expected.


bajoyjoy

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i don’t like the idea that congress has power to give away private people personal money (sss). that’s like mandating the bank to give certain group of people free money. 

Thank you, i posted a similar sentiment on my fb when this thing came out. sss money is not for the legislators to give out. they could've just proposed a certain percent increase in contribution and pension every __ years and leave the details to sss (which is how its always been done), baka lumusot pa.


bajoyjoy

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Let's stick to math,  Based on GSIS annual report for the year 2014, 88 BILLION PESOS paid on claims and benefits. 

If you say GSIS pensioners average monthly pension is 10k, it MAY MEAN there are now more than 700,000 people receiving pensions in government.  it is about 50% of total government employees of about 1.5 million.  Something is terribly wrong SCIENCE-wise.  It is either people are LIVING LONGER IN OLD AGE OR AVERAGE PENSION IS REALLY MORE THAN 10k per month. 

In government, it MIGHT BE 2 working for every 1 pensioner. VERY UNLIKELY.

Compare to SSS --- 33 million members with 2 million pensioners (less than 10% receives a person).  15 working for every 1 pensioner.

i donot get this sir bauer.



@bajoyjoy,

Let's break it down further.

GSIS - 9% employee share + 12% government share = 21%

SSS - 3.6% employee share + 7.5% company share = 11%

If this is the ONLY PARAMETER via percentage, your opinion is accurate indeed. SSS pensioners has nothing to compare because they are paying less.  BUT, this is not simply a case of percentages.  Why?

As per LAW for government employees - there is NO TOP RATE in salary bracket.  So if your salary gets higher, your pension will be higher as well (of course, the contribution is higher).   

Another injustice in computation of pension ---- Did you know that the computation of pension will be based on a retirees' last 3 YEARS in service?  Example,  if the government employee started at 5,000 pesos per month and then when he/she retires, his/her last salary for the past 3 years is 30,000 pesos per month, the pension will be based on 30k x a maximum of 90% so in effect, a government pensioner will receive 27,000 per month in pension.

In SSS LAW, there is a TOP RATE of 16,000 pesos.  It means, SSS contribution will not go beyond 1,790 pesos so that your pension when you are retiring, WILL BE MINISCULE compared to the LIVING EXPENSES. 

For example, private employee started on the same 5k per month in salary and upon retirement receives 30k per month in salary, his/her pension, upon retirement, will not be computed on the basis of his/her last 3 years monthly average salary BUT IT WILL BE ASSESSED BASED ON HIS/HER MONTHLY SALARY CREDITS FOR THE ENTIRE EMPLOYMENT YEARS.  Plus, it will be 20% ONLY of the MONTHLY SALARY CREDIT.  So if his AVERAGE MONTHLY CREDIT is 10,500 (5k+16k top rate=21/2) get the 20%, 2,100 pesos + 300 pesos = 2,400 pesos per month.

as i've said, there's something wrong in the formulation of sss contribution.

Quote
In other words, our existing LAWS are design to HELP government employees ACHIEVE A LIVING PENSION STANDARD after retirement while private employees are design just to provide BELOW LIVING PENSION STANDARD.  Where's fairness in this set-up?

Look at this percentage instead,

GSIS can receive at least 90% of their average monthly basic salary for the LAST 3 YEARS IN SERVICE.

SSS can receive MAXIMUM of 20% of the average monthly salary CREDITS for the ENTIRE YEARS IN EMPLOYMENT.

By LAWS, Government service receives SUPERIOR PENSION BENEFITS.  Who is paying for it? of course, it is US, being the TAX PAYERS.

In SSS, premiums were not raised NOT BECAUSE EMPLOYEES WILL COMPLAIN, IT IS BECAUSE THE EMPLOYERS WILL COMPLAIN MORE.  Our government is protecting the interest of Business OWNERS.  Not its workers.
You make it sound like its such a privilege to work in the PH government. if that's how unfair the situation is, why not a lot of people (including you) consider working in the government? dahil mababa ang tingin sa government employee diba. ang sweldo 1/2 lang ng counterpart nya sa private. lagi kang tatawaging bobo, inefficient, walang alam, etc.--kahit ang too, mahirap pumasa sa Civil service kaya marami sa private napupunta lol... imagine, for the whole duration of your career, titiisin mo ang panlalait na walang alam o bobo kayong nasa gobyerno, unlike sa private naka-japorms lagi, therefore, matalino lol... at nagtitiis ang mga nasa govt para lang sa GSIS pension? Ay mag-govt service na tayong lahat! :hihi:

The data I mentioned came directly from GSIS and SSS sources. how they came about with their figures, hindi ko na inalam.

as for increasing sss contributions, ayan si tulog sa pansitan mismo, was more than willing to forego sss as source of pension dahil nga katiting lang yan. and many others have that same sentiment, kaya nga nag-iinvest sa iba, nag-iisurance. dahil kung aasa ka sa sss, nganga talaga ang aabutin mo. those who are earning enough, you think mag-aksaya ng resources to increase their sss contribution, when there are other more viable investments. lagi din sinasabi ng mga umaangal sa sss contribution (and other mandatory contributions like pag-ibig and philhealth) nila, PERA NAMIN TO, HINDI KAMI EMPLEYADO NG GOBYERNO, wag nyoang pakialaman kung paano namin ggastusin ang sweldo namin.

Kung 30-50% na mas mataas ang sweldo ng mga nasa private kesa sa gobyerno, obligasyon nila sa sarili nila ang mag-ipon o itabi ang sobrang yan. kaya nga sa private sila nagttrabaho dahil mas malaki ang sweldo at mas maliit ang kaltas. sa public, pwersado ang pagkaltas ng gsis wala kang karapatang humindi o paliitin lang ang contribution mo. in that sense, unfair din para sa mga govt employees ang sitwasyon, na hindi mo kontrolado ang kinakaltas sayo.
« Last Edit: Jan 26, 2016, 02:51 PM by bajoyjoy »


bauer

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@bajoyjoy,

It's good we are discussing this issue regarding SSS because the way the government is treating this institution unfairly, I needed to compare it to GSIS so that we will know for sure HOW THE GOVT TREATS THE PEOPLE THEY SERVE AND HOW THEY TREAT THEMSELVES.

Let me provide you the latest financial report of GSIS for 2014

receipts from premiums (operating cash flow)           P 82.320 BILLION

payment of claims & benefits                                     P 88.261 BILLION

Based on government record, IF GSIS will just rely on premiums, there is already a VERY BIG DEFICIT that tax payers like us needed to pay for it.

Now why does GSIS reported a very high final income that it seems they are in good financial condition?

GSIS charter (law) states they are BOTH PENSION PROVIDER AND INSURANCE COMPANY.  There are 2 incomes and the income from Insurance are SUBSIDIZING THE DEFICITS in the pension contribution payments.

Now, since it is also an insurance, it means there will be insurances dividends just like a normal private insurance company right?  Yes, indeed.  the 21% in deduction, 3% went to insurance premium payments.  Hence, government employees also EARNS DIVIDENDS aside from the pension benefits they will receive in the future.  Nice di ba?

 Let's us check the SSS Annual Report of 2014

members' contribution                             P 120.650 BILLION

payments to members & beneficiaries    P 102.605 BILLION

We can see there are still a surplus amount but maybe in 1 year or 2, this figure will be in deficit as well.  This problem is alarming because the earnings from investment is not so large unlike GSIS.

See the difference between SSS and GSIS?   Next I am going to discuss the collection efficiency of SSS and also the operating expenses of SSS compared to other pension funds here and abroad.
 


bauer

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You make it sound like its such a privilege to work in the PH government. if that's how unfair the situation is, why not a lot of people (including you) consider working in the government? dahil mababa ang tingin sa government employee diba. ang sweldo 1/2 lang ng counterpart nya sa private. lagi kang tatawaging bobo, inefficient, walang alam, etc.--kahit ang too, mahirap pumasa sa Civil service kaya marami sa private napupunta lol... imagine, for the whole duration of your career, titiisin mo ang panlalait na walang alam o bobo kayong nasa gobyerno, unlike sa private naka-japorms lagi, therefore, matalino lol... at nagtitiis ang mga nasa govt para lang sa GSIS pension? Ay mag-govt service na tayong lahat! :hihi:

 

^Maybe in the past government salaries are quite LOW but not anymore because of the new laws like salary standardization law and other special laws. 

Did you know that public school teachers receives MORE PAY than their counterparts?

Let us go to the judiciary, public attorneys receives a decent pay similar to private lawyers.  Prosecutors, clerk of courts, judges, and justices receives SUPERIOR PAY than some of the lawyers working for legal firms.

Ang mababa na lang ang sweldo ang mga sundalo natin at mga taga linis ng kalsada at mga tanod. tingnan mo brgy captains sa Makati lahat may govt provided cars depende yan sa budget nila eh.  kung kaya, bigay ang luho.

Bakit hindi ako nagtrabaho?

1. gusto ko sana pero kailangan ng koneksiyon na matibay.
2. kapag may koneksiyon, kailangan "puppet" ka ng padrino mo.
3. mahirap magtagal sa gobyerno kung may labag sa batas ang ipapagawa sa iyo.
4. may magandang sweldo at benepisyo nga pero wala naman "resources" para magawa mo ng maayos ang trabaho kaya akala natin tamad sila sa trabaho at naka tanga lang ang mga taga gobyerno pero sa totoo lang walang CAPEX kasi.
5. walang maayos na patakaran at policies and procedures.  Kung may kapit --- pwede ang short cut.  kung wala --- red tape ang dadaanan mo.  Pati taga gobyerno dumadanas rin ng red tape.

« Last Edit: Jan 26, 2016, 03:59 PM by bauer »


bauer

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Kung 30-50% na mas mataas ang sweldo ng mga nasa private kesa sa gobyerno, obligasyon nila sa sarili nila ang mag-ipon o itabi ang sobrang yan. kaya nga sa private sila nagttrabaho dahil mas malaki ang sweldo at mas maliit ang kaltas. sa public, pwersado ang pagkaltas ng gsis wala kang karapatang humindi o paliitin lang ang contribution mo. in that sense, unfair din para sa mga govt employees ang sitwasyon, na hindi mo kontrolado ang kinakaltas sayo.

^ SSS man or GSIS, tao lang lahat.  kahit naman siguro taga gobyerno gusto nila konti lang rin ang kaltas at Malaki ang benepisyo.  Ganyan rin sa SSS, sino ba ang may gusto sa malaking kaltas?  wala naman di ba? pero sigurado ko lahat ang gusto MALAKI ang benepisyo.  Walang pinagka iba sa Greece.  Palpak ang patakbo ng gobyerno kaya naubos ang pera kaya naman binawasan rin ang mga pensiyon nila kasi nga wala na silang pera.  Ngayon nag aalsa mga pensioners di ba?

Bakit ba konti lang ang mayaman at mas marami ang mahirap?  Kasi karamihan hindi marunong humawak ng pera.  Kailangan ang ayuda ng gobyerno para maiwasan ang "chaos".  Yan ang obligasyon ng gobyerno --- mapanatili ang kaayusan sa lipunan.  kasama na diyan ang siguraduhin ang pag aaruga sa pagtanda ng lahat ng mamamayan.


bauer

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i donot get this sir bauer.

as i've said, there's something wrong in the formulation of sss contribution.
 

^ Let me clarify it again.

UNFAIRNESS IN COMPUTATION OF PENSION BENEFITS (contribution we already agreed that SSS is 11% while GSIS is 21%)

GSIS  ---- Pension based on AVERAGE OF LAST 3 years in service salary.

SSS ---- Pension based on AVERAGE OF ALL your employment years.

Diyan pa lang sa rules na yan hindi na importante kung maliit ba or Malaki ang kaltas.

Eto pa, pagkatapos mo makuha ang AVERAGE MONTHLY SALARY,

GSIS = Average monthly salary X maximum 90% = pension amount

SSS = Average monthly salary X 20% plus 300 pesos = pension amount

90% versus 20% isa na naman pang alipusta di ba?
« Last Edit: Jan 26, 2016, 04:15 PM by bauer »


DreamWalker

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SSS Pension Computation
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YC7iY_7s1yc

1. the sum of P300 plus 20 percent of the average monthly salary credit plus two percent of the average monthly salary credit for each credited year of service (CYS) in excess of ten years; or
2. forty (40) percent of the average monthly salary credit; or
3. P1,200, if the CYS is at least 10 but less than 20; or P2,400, if the CYS is 20 or more.

https://www.sss.gov.ph/sss/appmanager/pages.jsp?page=retirementpension


wilch23

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@bajoyjoy,

Let's break it down further.

GSIS - 9% employee share + 12% government share = 21%

SSS - 3.6% employee share + 7.5% company share = 11%

VERY Relevant INFO!

As per LAW for government employees - there is NO TOP RATE in salary bracket.  So if your salary gets higher, your pension will be higher as well (of course, the contribution is higher).   

This is not an injustice tho, it is simply how each was designed. No TOP RATE also means deductions goes higher as salary rises while the SSS has a max contribution limit.

Another injustice in computation of pension ---- Did you know that the computation of pension will be based on a retirees' last 3 YEARS in service?  Example,  if the government employee started at 5,000 pesos per month and then when he/she retires, his/her last salary for the past 3 years is 30,000 pesos per month, the pension will be based on 30k x a maximum of 90% so in effect, a government pensioner will receive 27,000 per month in pension.

So the GSIS is more of a WELFARE FUND? I wonder whether the national govt is subsidizing it at all? Or are the collections and earnings enough to provide the obligated benefits?

In SSS LAW, there is a TOP RATE of 16,000 pesos.  It means, SSS contribution will not go beyond 1,790 pesos so that your pension when you are retiring, WILL BE MINISCULE compared to the LIVING EXPENSES. 

For example, private employee started on the same 5k per month in salary and upon retirement receives 30k per month in salary, his/her pension, upon retirement, will not be computed on the basis of his/her last 3 years monthly average salary BUT IT WILL BE ASSESSED BASED ON HIS/HER MONTHLY SALARY CREDITS FOR THE ENTIRE EMPLOYMENT YEARS.  Plus, it will be 20% ONLY of the MONTHLY SALARY CREDIT.  So if his AVERAGE MONTHLY CREDIT is 10,500 (5k+16k top rate=21/2) get the 20%, 2,100 pesos + 300 pesos = 2,400 pesos per month.

In other words, GSIS is more generous in giving out retirement benefits. The rough est of SSS is for a guy who worked 30years, SSS expect to break even (just return the 11% without any interest) if he receives pension for under 20 years, the interest will be for the funeral and surviving dependents/spouse, if any.

BTW, the AFP has an even better plan (for them not us taxpayers) the monthly pension is based on the last rank of the retiree. Ok lang yan. But there is more, what the retiree receives is the SAME MONTHLY SALARY of an ACTIVE officer of the same rank as his! So kung captain ka when you retired, you will receive pension equal to the CURRENT salary of a captain!


In other words, our existing LAWS are design to HELP government employees ACHIEVE A LIVING PENSION STANDARD after retirement while private employees are design just to provide BELOW LIVING PENSION STANDARD.  Where's fairness in this set-up?

Look at this percentage instead,

GSIS can receive at least 90% of their average monthly basic salary for the LAST 3 YEARS IN SERVICE.

SSS can receive MAXIMUM of 20% of the average monthly salary CREDITS for the ENTIRE YEARS IN EMPLOYMENT.

By LAWS, Government service receives SUPERIOR PENSION BENEFITS.  Who is paying for it? of course, it is US, being the TAX PAYERS.

In SSS, premiums were not raised NOT BECAUSE EMPLOYEES WILL COMPLAIN, IT IS BECAUSE THE EMPLOYERS WILL COMPLAIN MORE.  Our government is protecting the interest of Business OWNERS.  Not its workers.


wilch23

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Thank you, i posted a similar sentiment on my fb when this thing came out. sss money is not for the legislators to give out. they could've just proposed a certain percent increase in contribution and pension every __ years and leave the details to sss (which is how its always been done), baka lumusot pa.

I don't quite agree. They may have a right to give it out. They are also responsible for making sure the fund doesn't go kaput.

Based on the contributions, even with voluntary members (very small % lang), much more than half of the money with the SSS is govt money, that is from the SEED Capital and the mandated (FORCED) contribution of the employers (indirect TAXATION).
There is also additional govt funding from time to time to help sustain the fund. So hindi naman yata private fund eto, quasi private only.
Really more public than private.
« Last Edit: Jan 27, 2016, 11:54 AM by wilch23 »


wilch23

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So far, we can conclude that GSIS members are better off than SSS members during retirement albeit they get less each payday during employment.

The AFP has the best pension benefits by a mile.

« Last Edit: Jan 27, 2016, 11:57 AM by wilch23 »


wilch23

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I read an interesting column the other day.
Basically it says there are 2 types of social security fund - "Pay As You Go" or "Privatized". The first type pays for the benefits using membership dues and earnings while the 2nd is run much like a mutual fund, ie the benefits are equitable to the corresponding contributions.

That author compares our SSS to the 1st type, which sounds like a pyramid scheme to me.
The way the current arguments are going - getting additional funding/contribution to give out more benefits - seems to support this comparison. I have always thought of the SSS as a pyramiding scheme, albeit a legal one - PARADOX warning.


palailai

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Tama si Bauer mahirapppp mag-apply sa govierno kailangan talaga ng backer/padrino...tulad ng kapatid ko nag apply sa Dep-Ed sinabihan siya ng school district head na humingi ng recomendations sa congressman dito sa Davao....buti na lang nakapasok.

kahit contractual/job order need pa rin ng backer...kasi mag aaply ka sa city hall na walang backer walang mangyyayari sa pagsubmit ng mga resume/application letter...di yan papansininn....


 


jenofstructures

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bottom line:  Wag asahan ang SSS
Battle cry na ata ng lahat ng finance books ito.


darthjuday

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Kung tutuusin mas maganda pay out nito kaysa whole life insurance, lalo na pag kinosider mo na 1/3 lang ng hulog ang sayo at 2/3 sa employer mo. Yun nga lang di ka naman pwede kumuha dito ng malakihan so ganun lang talaga ang matatanggap mo sa huli.


BatangHamog

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Pardon if this is an ot..i just would like to share something..

An hsbc investment sales guy came to visit me in my office and i was offered for a something like when i find out of a retirement investment plan (short term plan 10 years)...he elaborated 2 kinds of scheme/plan..

1. 900 $usd/month - something like he called as a "Protection scheme"..
2. 1300 $usd/month - this looks to me like the retirement plan, dead/sick or alive after 10 years, a guaranteed 240k $usd is awaiting for my claim.

although i can afford the above both offer and not yet fully understood the overall shape of the offer in terms of legalities & conditions of the contract..

if you were in my position, do you think the above mentioned offer is worth it of your time to wait and the amount of money you're going to loose each month (total approx 100k pesos)? Having the 240k $usd back of our heads, could it compensate a probable earnings/ROI from an alternative investment if same amount of figures will be spent?

thanks in advance for those whose going to respond.


darthjuday

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No. 2 looks good to me, panigurado kung wala pang insurance


bauer

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Pardon if this is an ot..i just would like to share something..

An hsbc investment sales guy came to visit me in my office and i was offered for a something like when i find out of a retirement investment plan (short term plan 10 years)...he elaborated 2 kinds of scheme/plan..

1. 900 $usd/month - something like he called as a "Protection scheme"..
2. 1300 $usd/month - this looks to me like the retirement plan, dead/sick or alive after 10 years, a guaranteed 240k $usd is awaiting for my claim.

 

^ scheme 2 - 1,300 x 120 months (tama ba you need to pay it for 10 years?) = US$ 156,000 dollars total invested fund.  Kelan mo naman makukuha ang guaranteed US$ 240k mo?  Diyan mo malalaman kung maganda mag invest or hindi.  Be careful.... check the details of your investment.  paano kung hindi mo matapos ang hulog ano mangyayari? forfeited ba? (delikado yan) or full refund? (maganda yan)


bauer

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^ On SSS collection efficiency

As of March 2015 --- SSS reported 32.5 million members with over 920,000 employers.

Last financial statement 2014, SSS reported contributions of 120.650 Billion pesos.

A quick analysis --- IF WE ASSUME A MINIMUM COMBINE PAYMENT OF 550 PESOS PER MONTH FOR A 5K MONTHLY SALARY CREDIT,   32.5 million x 550 pesos = 17.875 BILLION PESOS PER MONTH IN CONTRIBUTION

for 12 months the total theoretically must be 214.5 BILLION PESOS.  Compare it to total contribution collected of 120.650 Billion.

Missing Difference in supposedly 100% collection efficiency was 93.85 BILLION.   

What is the collection efficiency of SSS then?  it is about 43.75% ONLY. Horrendous isn't it?  They missed to collect 56% of total contribution just in ONE YEAR.

Tapos people in SSS needs the understanding of pensioners ?  People need to understand PNOY kaya walang 2,000 pesos pay hike?

Kaya pala ayaw ng SSS at gobyerno sa third party independent audit at baka sa ilang dekada ng operasyon nila (more than 50 years) lumitaw ang totoo na TRILLIONS na ang losses.

Next I'm going to compare their operating expense compared to other government pension funds.  Things are too dark already.


IGX

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^ scheme 2 - 1,300 x 120 months (tama ba you need to pay it for 10 years?) = US$ 156,000 dollars total invested fund.  Kelan mo naman makukuha ang guaranteed US$ 240k mo?  Diyan mo malalaman kung maganda mag invest or hindi.  Be careful.... check the details of your investment.  paano kung hindi mo matapos ang hulog ano mangyayari? forfeited ba? (delikado yan) or full refund? (maganda yan)

sir bauer do you think its still wise to invest in things like this? seems like the endowement plan of sunlife.  what is the safety net in case hsbc defaults?


BatangHamog

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^ scheme 2 - 1,300 x 120 months (tama ba you need to pay it for 10 years?) = US$ 156,000 dollars total invested fund.  Kelan mo naman makukuha ang guaranteed US$ 240k mo?  Diyan mo malalaman kung maganda mag invest or hindi.  Be careful.... check the details of your investment.  paano kung hindi mo matapos ang hulog ano mangyayari? forfeited ba? (delikado yan) or full refund? (maganda yan)

Thanks for the response.

Well as per hsbc guy, a notification or letter (looks like a promisory note to me) from my side should be given to their office if there will be times or months that i wont able to make that monthly payment for a certain number of months, i have raised this question to the hsbc guy. No they wont forfeit naman but i dont know what will be the consequence or subsequent effect having such scenario (e.g if i loose a job and no draw of salary for 3-6months to make the monthly contribution). I would have to make clear of this matter with the bank. thanks for reminding.  :thankyou:


darthjuday

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No. 2 looks good to me, panigurado kung wala pang insurance

pagkakaintindi ko kasi you get the 240 after 10 years, so quickie straight comp is 5.3% annual interest (higher in actual). ibang usapan kung 10 pay pala pero ang maturity is say 20 years away.


DreamWalker

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^ On SSS collection efficiency

As of March 2015 --- SSS reported 32.5 million members with over 920,000 employers.

Last financial statement 2014, SSS reported contributions of 120.650 Billion pesos.

A quick analysis --- IF WE ASSUME A MINIMUM COMBINE PAYMENT OF 550 PESOS PER MONTH FOR A 5K MONTHLY SALARY CREDIT,   32.5 million x 550 pesos = 17.875 BILLION PESOS PER MONTH IN CONTRIBUTION

for 12 months the total theoretically must be 214.5 BILLION PESOS.  Compare it to total contribution collected of 120.650 Billion.

Missing Difference in supposedly 100% collection efficiency was 93.85 BILLION.   

What is the collection efficiency of SSS then?  it is about 43.75% ONLY. Horrendous isn't it?  They missed to collect 56% of total contribution just in ONE YEAR.

Tapos people in SSS needs the understanding of pensioners ?  People need to understand PNOY kaya walang 2,000 pesos pay hike?

Kaya pala ayaw ng SSS at gobyerno sa third party independent audit at baka sa ilang dekada ng operasyon nila (more than 50 years) lumitaw ang totoo na TRILLIONS na ang losses.

Next I'm going to compare their operating expense compared to other government pension funds.  Things are too dark already.

Its not correct to assume that all of the 32.5M members are paying members, madaming members na meron sss number pero wala naman trabaho and ung iba eh ofw na or nag migrate na at hindi nagtutuloy ng hulog.  Like sa semicon industry or epza madaming babaeng empleyado pag na retrench or nag asawa sila hindi na makakapag patuloy ng hulog and they are still considered sss members. So sa ganitong sitwasyon ano ibabayad sa sss kung wala ngang trabaho o ayaw naman mag contribute voluntarily. or puwede din mapunta sa govt sector at sa gsis na maghulog


wilch23

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Kung tutuusin mas maganda pay out nito kaysa whole life insurance, lalo na pag kinosider mo na 1/3 lang ng hulog ang sayo at 2/3 sa employer mo. Yun nga lang di ka naman pwede kumuha dito ng malakihan so ganun lang talaga ang matatanggap mo sa huli.

I agree.

While it is true the pension is a pittance, it is also true that it is a good investment if only bec almost 2/3 of the contribution is given by your employer.

Since maliit ang contribution ni member, how can he expect a large pay out.
The culprit should be the SSS manager falling way behind in earnings generation vis-a-vis inflation. But we have to consider also that they haev to be prudent and not too aggressive in their investments.
Bottom line is it is still better than fix income instruments.
« Last Edit: Jan 29, 2016, 08:05 AM by wilch23 »


wilch23

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Collection is a problem since it started.
How bad is it? We don't know except for what SSS tells us.
Audit by REAL external private firm?
Be ready for a subterranean city of worms!


bajoyjoy

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^Maybe in the past government salaries are quite LOW but not anymore because of the new laws like salary standardization law and other special laws. 
but SSLs only happen once every blue moon. hintayin muna nilang mapag-iwanan ulit bago sila magkukumahog humabol sa sweldo sa private. at sa lower grades lang talaga ung nagiging competitive rates, pag sa supervisor level and up na, milya-milya na ang agwat even after govt salary adjustments.

incidentally, i just saw in the news, hindi pa rin magka-ayos ang bicam sa govt salary rate hike bill.. and one hitch yata is yun ngang sinasabi ni wilch na scheme for retired AFP personnel, na wala na sa serbisyo pero mag-aadjust ang pension based on the current salary ng kanilang last position. very clever.

Quote
Did you know that public school teachers receives MORE PAY than their counterparts?
This is true, but only because demand for public teachers is high and supply is low right now. again, in our country, teachers are looked down upon so only noble ones choose to be teachers, lalo na kung public teacher, parang 70 students per class ang hahawakan mo buong maghapon. To stop them from leaving and accepting yaya jobs abroad, and to attract others into the profession, they had to get competitive salary rates din.
Quote

Let us go to the judiciary, public attorneys receives a decent pay similar to private lawyers.  Prosecutors, clerk of courts, judges, and justices receives SUPERIOR PAY than some of the lawyers working for legal firms.
you are talking about BASIC PAY. yes basic pay has improved for them, but as we all know sa private, they always find ways to "disguise" real compensation and emoluments, for tax purposes. for private firm lawyers, basic pay lang ang declared, but its really the non-salary benefits that spell the difference, minsan 2x or 3x ng basic ang mga yun.

Quote

Bakit hindi ako nagtrabaho?

1. gusto ko sana pero kailangan ng koneksiyon na matibay.
2. kapag may koneksiyon, kailangan "puppet" ka ng padrino mo.
3. mahirap magtagal sa gobyerno kung may labag sa batas ang ipapagawa sa iyo.
4. may magandang sweldo at benepisyo nga pero wala naman "resources" para magawa mo ng maayos ang trabaho kaya akala natin tamad sila sa trabaho at naka tanga lang ang mga taga gobyerno pero sa totoo lang walang CAPEX kasi.
5. walang maayos na patakaran at policies and procedures.  Kung may kapit --- pwede ang short cut.  kung wala --- red tape ang dadaanan mo.  Pati taga gobyerno dumadanas rin ng red tape.

no. 1 and 2--> MYTH. i've worked in 3 govt institutions, WALA AKONG KONEKSYON O BACKER WHATSOEVER. but yes, everytime uninformed people find out i work/ed at xxx  they ALWAYS say "may backer ka noh?". I pity them.  :hihi:

in those offices na napasukan ko, mabibilang mo lang ang may koneksyon. may ganitong paniniwala dahil ang mga supposed backer ang mahilig mag-press release na "ipinasok ko si xxxx" etc na parang sila ang nagpa-exam, interview at pumirma ng appointment papers. but these people are inconsequential to the selection process unless sila talaga ung nasa selection board. nagpa-submit lang ng resume sa HR, sya na ang nagpasok?  :hihi:

of all your reasons above, its clear GSIS pension never figured into your decision making, because its really just incidental that GSIS pension system is MORE SOUND than SSS. when you say unfair, its like gsis was favored more than the sss.  the disparity of these 2 laws (GSIS and SSS charters) can only be cured by the legislators and thats what they failed to do when the bill was veto'ed because they did not study the numbers properly (serge osmena has admitted this). parang naging "dare" ung bill, akala nila makakalusot dahil eleksyon na at matatakot ang administrasyon na mawala ang boto para kay Mar kaya ppayagan nila. Pnoy called their bluff because what these epals failed to consider is, si Mar ang matatalo sa eleksyon hindi si Pnoy. Pnoy has nothing to lose anymore, he probably want his projects and agenda to continue kung manalo ng LP pero kung hindi, e di hindi.






« Last Edit: Jan 29, 2016, 09:13 AM by bajoyjoy »


bajoyjoy

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I don't quite agree. They may have a right to give it out. They are also responsible for making sure the fund doesn't go kaput.

Based on the contributions, even with voluntary members (very small % lang), much more than half of the money with the SSS is govt money, that is from the SEED Capital and the mandated (FORCED) contribution of the employers (indirect TAXATION).
There is also additional govt funding from time to time to help sustain the fund. So hindi naman yata private fund eto, quasi private only.
Really more public than private.
I just meant SSS not congress/senate is in the best position to say if the proposal is sustainable or not. SSS said no, but maybe a lower amount. The lawmakers insisted on the 2k like its their money to give away.

but yes any money that goes into any govt entity automatically becomes public money and for public purpose. we'd think lawmakers would know this, but....


« Last Edit: Jan 29, 2016, 09:39 AM by bajoyjoy »


jmces

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@bajoyjoy you don't know anyone working on the same gov't offices before you joined? your family is unknown to them? btw those someone that usually sends the resume to HR does not necessarily mean they just give your resume, usually it's more like they will ask the hiring boss and go to HR to process the formalities :D


bajoyjoy

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^ On SSS collection efficiency

As of March 2015 --- SSS reported 32.5 million members with over 920,000 employers.

Last financial statement 2014, SSS reported contributions of 120.650 Billion pesos.

A quick analysis --- IF WE ASSUME A MINIMUM COMBINE PAYMENT OF 550 PESOS PER MONTH FOR A 5K MONTHLY SALARY CREDIT,   32.5 million x 550 pesos = 17.875 BILLION PESOS PER MONTH IN CONTRIBUTION

for 12 months the total theoretically must be 214.5 BILLION PESOS.  Compare it to total contribution collected of 120.650 Billion.

Missing Difference in supposedly 100% collection efficiency was 93.85 BILLION.   

What is the collection efficiency of SSS then?  it is about 43.75% ONLY. Horrendous isn't it?  They missed to collect 56% of total contribution just in ONE YEAR.

Tapos people in SSS needs the understanding of pensioners ?  People need to understand PNOY kaya walang 2,000 pesos pay hike?

Kaya pala ayaw ng SSS at gobyerno sa third party independent audit at baka sa ilang dekada ng operasyon nila (more than 50 years) lumitaw ang totoo na TRILLIONS na ang losses.

Next I'm going to compare their operating expense compared to other government pension funds.  Things are too dark already.

I wanted to follow yung computations pero nawiwindang talaga ako pag madami na akong numbers na nababasa, hahaha... but im inclined to believe the numbers are dismal.

but on the issue of collection efficiency per se... i'd compare it to BIR. which among the taxpayers are the BIR's bread and butter? the wage earners-- kasi bago mo pa mahawakan ang sweldo mo, nauna na ang BIR na kumuha ng share nya. captured taxpayers sila unlike corporate taxpayers (lalo nung before henares era) daming tax shields and deductibles na pwedeng magamit para maliit ang taxable income nila. so tax collection efficiency mas mataas dun sa captured taxpayers (wage earners). Same with GSIS, share muna nila bago mapunta sa tao ung sweldo nya. For SSS, its not the case dahil marami nga ang members that are not in the formal employment sector, marami din ang hindi nagtuloy gaya ng nasabi ni dreamwalker. i have an sss number myself but dont pay any. marami din kumuha lang ng sss para sa ID... and marami ring balahurang private employers na nagdededuct ng sss pero hindi nagreremit. when payment process is not automatic or convenient, collection efficiency will surely fail. hindi naman yan meralco na pupuntahan ka sa bahay kung hindi nakabayad.


bajoyjoy

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@bajoyjoy you don't know anyone working on the same gov't offices before you joined? your family is unknown to them?
NO. i only have 2 relatives in the government, i worked as a project based contractual (not considered as employee so i didnt include this) in a different branch of their office. i never got a permanent post sa office nila. i moved to 3 different offices AND I HAVE NO RELATIONS TO ANYONE PERSONALLY. ung 1st permanent position ko wala akong kilala, but nung nagreport nako dun ko nakita ung clasmate ko nung college, sabay kami ng 1st day of work. ung 2nd, may classmate din ako and sya pinagsubmit ko ng resume. ang kabilin-bilinan sakin, dont ever mention me in your interview. the selection board is headed by aaaa, and she's the aunt of my ex. does that count as backer, nega ang effect sa chance kong makuha? the last one, i have tons of classmates (college and law) all over, but none of them knew i was applying until i got in or bumped into them months after my 1st day.

Quote
btw those someone that usually sends the resume to HR does not necessarily mean they just give your resume, usually it's more like they will ask the hiring boss and go to HR to process the formalities :D
isama na kita dun sa people i pity because of their ignorance of the selection process. :hihi: but maybe we're talking about different govt institutions, hindi kasi ako nag-attempt mag-apply sa mga pangit ang reputasyon, pugad ng mga politicians and grafters. i go for good reputation, always.

kung may kilala kang ganyan ang press release sayo, wag kang maniwala. those who are really in the position to wield such power WILL NEVER DISCLOSE TO ANYONE that they do that. and those who so proudly claim they are responsible for that person getting in (ibinulong na kita! echosero!), in reality walang kinalaman sa buong proseso, sya lang siguro nag-stapler ng papeles. lol

maliban na lang siguro sa mga highly-confidential positions like staff ng mismong head ng office, yun talga mga handpicked nila pero co-term lang din.  anyway OT na....




jmces

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@bajoyjoy well good for you, im happy that not all govt agencies are the same. i am not ignorant because i saw it first hand, and you are correct, this office is one of the playgrounds of politicians and people are dying to get in, but most of the applicants, even fully qualified, have their resumes sitting on the desks, while those who just graduated without the necessary credentials are being hired as advised by the padrinos. one more thing aside from the gsis benefits gov't employees while maybe not everyone have access to the previously known fund as the pork barrell, which will be given in forms of bonuses, gifts, or whatsoever term they use. personally i think benefit wise, govt employees are superior than their private sector counterparts.


bajoyjoy

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@bajoyjoy well good for you, im happy that not all govt agencies are the same. i am not ignorant because i saw it first hand, and you are correct, this office is one of the playgrounds of politicians and people are dying to get in, but most of the applicants, even fully qualified, have their resumes sitting on the desks, while those who just graduated without the necessary credentials are being hired as advised by the padrinos.
yes if there is no merit-based recruitment system most likely bulok ang agency na yan. buti na rin siguro hindi napapasok ang mga mahuhusay pero napupulitika na mga applicants sa mga ganyan, kakainin lang sila ng sistema. for the newbies kasi, tutal bulok na tingin nyo sa akin dahil sa reputasyon ng office ko, e hindi na rin ako magmamalinis at makipagsabayan na rin sa pagnanakaw.

Quote
one more thing aside from the gsis benefits gov't employees while maybe not everyone have access to the previously known fund as the pork barrell, which will be given in forms of bonuses, gifts, or whatsoever term they use. personally i think benefit wise, govt employees are superior than their private sector counterparts.
this is very surprising to me jmces. i've always thought mataas ang sweldo sa private, pati na rin benefits, minsan umaabot ng 18-20th month bonus, car plan and transpo, etc... except for the few na abusadong agencies like mwss na 24 months bonus yata yun at kung ano-ano pang natatanggap na extra kada buwan...

so does it mean pinapasiklaban lang ako ng friend ko sa private sector na kung pumustura ng bonggang designer clothes, bags and watches? Pampalubag loob iniisip ko na lng, may kino-cover up itong kalungkutan kaya kung ano-anong luho ang binibili... hahahaha bitter pa more! :rofl:


bauer

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sir bauer do you think its still wise to invest in things like this? seems like the endowement plan of sunlife.  what is the safety net in case hsbc defaults?

^ A hybrid insurance + investment product is not wise (at least what is offered in our country but I do not know if it is good in other country).  Theoretically speaking, HSBC is a private company, of course if HSBC defaults, there are no safety nets.  Remember, an insurance is a PROMISE.


bauer

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Its not correct to assume that all of the 32.5M members are paying members, madaming members na meron sss number pero wala naman trabaho and ung iba eh ofw na or nag migrate na at hindi nagtutuloy ng hulog.  Like sa semicon industry or epza madaming babaeng empleyado pag na retrench or nag asawa sila hindi na makakapag patuloy ng hulog and they are still considered sss members. So sa ganitong sitwasyon ano ibabayad sa sss kung wala ngang trabaho o ayaw naman mag contribute voluntarily. or puwede din mapunta sa govt sector at sa gsis na maghulog

^ Oh I am sorry you are not familiar with an audit procedure.   How do you measure collection efficiency?  SSS reported those numbers (32.5 million members)


bauer

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but SSLs only happen once every blue moon. hintayin muna nilang mapag-iwanan ulit bago sila magkukumahog humabol sa sweldo sa private. at sa lower grades lang talaga ung nagiging competitive rates, pag sa supervisor level and up na, milya-milya na ang agwat even after govt salary adjustments.
 

^ Didn't you know there were SSL 1, SSL 2, and SSL3?  Congress is talking about SSL 4 already.  Mabilis kaya sila pagdating sa sweldo at benepisyo.


bauer

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Collection is a problem since it started.
How bad is it? We don't know except for what SSS tells us.
Audit by REAL external private firm?
Be ready for a subterranean city of worms!

^LOL


bauer

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This is true, but only because demand for public teachers is high and supply is low right now. again, in our country, teachers are looked down upon so only noble ones choose to be teachers, lalo na kung public teacher, parang 70 students per class ang hahawakan mo buong maghapon. To stop them from leaving and accepting yaya jobs abroad, and to attract others into the profession, they had to get competitive salary rates din.you are talking about BASIC PAY. yes basic pay has improved for them, but as we all know sa private, they always find ways to "disguise" real compensation and emoluments, for tax purposes. for private firm lawyers, basic pay lang ang declared, but its really the non-salary benefits that spell the difference, minsan 2x or 3x ng basic ang mga yun.
 

^CHED 2010-2011 graduates data reported that about 60,000 completed education & teacher's training courses.

Manila Bulletin reported that DEPED to address shortages in teachers will HIRE 33,000 in 2014.

2011 pa lang kalahati na sobra sa 2014 hiring plan.  I do not think there is a LACK OF SUPPLY.  Do you have some data?


IGX

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^ A hybrid insurance + investment product is not wise (at least what is offered in our country but I do not know if it is good in other country).  Theoretically speaking, HSBC is a private company, of course if HSBC defaults, there are no safety nets.  Remember, an insurance is a PROMISE.

Thanks for your input sir bauer. 


bauer

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of all your reasons above, its clear GSIS pension never figured into your decision making, because its really just incidental that GSIS pension system is MORE SOUND than SSS. when you say unfair, its like gsis was favored more than the sss.  the disparity of these 2 laws (GSIS and SSS charters) can only be cured by the legislators and thats what they failed to do when the bill was veto'ed because they did not study the numbers properly (serge osmena has admitted this). parang naging "dare" ung bill, akala nila makakalusot dahil eleksyon na at matatakot ang administrasyon na mawala ang boto para kay Mar kaya ppayagan nila. Pnoy called their bluff because what these epals failed to consider is, si Mar ang matatalo sa eleksyon hindi si Pnoy. Pnoy has nothing to lose anymore, he probably want his projects and agenda to continue kung manalo ng LP pero kung hindi, e di hindi.


^ I need to CLARIFY SOME FACTS ---- GSIS is supported by 5 LAWS not 1.  That is how good the government take care of themselves.

SSL (salary standardization law) - 3 na at yung 4th malapit na maging batas.  GSIS 5 ang batas.


bauer

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incidentally, i just saw in the news, hindi pa rin magka-ayos ang bicam sa govt salary rate hike bill.. and one hitch yata is yun ngang sinasabi ni wilch na scheme for retired AFP personnel, na wala na sa serbisyo pero mag-aadjust ang pension based on the current salary ng kanilang last position. very clever.
 no. 1 and 2--> MYTH. i've worked in 3 govt institutions, WALA AKONG KONEKSYON O BACKER WHATSOEVER. but yes, everytime uninformed people find out i work/ed at xxx  they ALWAYS say "may backer ka noh?". I pity them.  :hihi:

in those offices na napasukan ko, mabibilang mo lang ang may koneksyon. may ganitong paniniwala dahil ang mga supposed backer ang mahilig mag-press release na "ipinasok ko si xxxx" etc na parang sila ang nagpa-exam, interview at pumirma ng appointment papers. but these people are inconsequential to the selection process unless sila talaga ung nasa selection board. nagpa-submit lang ng resume sa HR, sya na ang nagpasok?  :hihi:

 

^ Our AFP-PNP pension budget is now 70 BILLION pesos good for 211,000 retirees.  If I will take the average, each one receives about 26k per month in pension.  Talking about GSIS versus SSS.  Mas maganda pala sa ating AFP-PNP.  bumawi sa dulo dahil sa mababang sweldo ng sundalo.

@bajoyjoy, You are one of the lucky few that did not require a 'padrino'.  Kaya lang, why were you not made a regular employee yun ba reason kaya ka umalis sa gov't.? (no offense meant).


bauer

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I wanted to follow yung computations pero nawiwindang talaga ako pag madami na akong numbers na nababasa, hahaha... but im inclined to believe the numbers are dismal.

  For SSS, its not the case dahil marami nga ang members that are not in the formal employment sector, marami din ang hindi nagtuloy gaya ng nasabi ni dreamwalker. i have an sss number myself but dont pay any. marami din kumuha lang ng sss para sa ID... and marami ring balahurang private employers na nagdededuct ng sss pero hindi nagreremit. when payment process is not automatic or convenient, collection efficiency will surely fail. hindi naman yan meralco na pupuntahan ka sa bahay kung hindi nakabayad.

^Maybe you should seek time to read the SSS reports (you can download it in their website -- I did it).

SSS reported more than 900,000 employers.  There are less than 200,000 recalcitrant employers (did not submit or deficient in their contributions).  SSS filed less than 5,000 cases only.   Remind you, both MERALCO at SSS may kulong ang parusa sa non-payment.

Paano naman tataas ang collection efficiency kung hindi naghahabol?

Remember that SSS employees are GOVERNMENT run and their benefits are GSIS-based.  Ganda di ba?


bauer

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yes if there is no merit-based recruitment system most likely bulok ang agency na yan. buti na rin siguro hindi napapasok ang mga mahuhusay pero napupulitika na mga applicants sa mga ganyan, kakainin lang sila ng sistema. for the newbies kasi, tutal bulok na tingin nyo sa akin dahil sa reputasyon ng office ko, e hindi na rin ako magmamalinis at makipagsabayan na rin sa pagnanakaw.
   

^I could not believe your last statement.  Do you think there is a need to expound?  The way you right seems your upright.


jmces

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@bajoyjoy most people na mahilig magpasiklab e walang ibubuga or baka naman senior management sya ng company? , some of them max out their credit limit just to buy luxuries which they cannot afford. private companies including the one i work for previously pays up to 24 months at 1 point but the basic salary is so low that if you get the annual income is just the same as others.


wilch23

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Kawawa ang SSS members pala when compared to GSIS members lalo na sa AFP!

BTW sobrang taas ng operating cost ng SSS. Dapat yan 2-5% lang ng premiums collected. Looking at their offices and official vehicles, furniture, office appliances and equipment, SAAN kaya napunta ang PERA?
Puro SALARY lang?
Mahiya naman si De Quiros ( tama ba name nya) and his admin, lahat na sila working there!
And why should they get a bonus kung maganda ang income ng investments, that fund is a TRUST FUND. MANAGERS lang sila na may fixed fee/salary. WHY, pag lugi ba sa bear market, babayaran nila ang losses?

Yan ang dapat baguhin but does Noy even understands this?


bajoyjoy

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^CHED 2010-2011 graduates data reported that about 60,000 completed education & teacher's training courses.

Manila Bulletin reported that DEPED to address shortages in teachers will HIRE 33,000 in 2014.

2011 pa lang kalahati na sobra sa 2014 hiring plan.  I do not think there is a LACK OF SUPPLY.  Do you have some data?
yes that's what was talking about, nag-intensify ng recruitment for public teachers. so kailan sila nag-increase ng sweldo ng public teachers? before or after 2014? and i mean QUALIFIED supply. graduates of educ do not automatically become teachers, only 27% (elem) and 31% (secondary) pass the LET exam.


@bajoyjoy, You are one of the lucky few that did not require a 'padrino'.  Kaya lang, why were you not made a regular employee yun ba reason kaya ka umalis sa gov't.? (no offense meant).

qualified naman ako bauer hindi lucky, most qualified din siguro. hahaha

it was my first job na research assistant. hindi ko na hinintay mapermanent. i'm still in the govt, lipat-lipat lang ng offices.

@bajoyjoy most people na mahilig magpasiklab e walang ibubuga or baka naman senior management sya ng company? , some of them max out their credit limit just to buy luxuries which they cannot afford. private companies including the one i work for previously pays up to 24 months at 1 point but the basic salary is so low that if you get the annual income is just the same as others.

that's very comforting jmces.

^I could not believe your last statement.  Do you think there is a need to expound?  The way you right seems your upright.

lets say its bureau of customs. any newbie na papasok sa customs ang iniisip madaling yumaman jan diba kaya nga nagpupumilit pumasok jan. its common knowledge. the extent of corruption and pagnanakaw hindi nila gaanong naiintindihan until makita na nila in real life. kung maayos kang tao, matatakot ka-- ganito pala dito.. you would give it up dahil hindi mo masisikmura ang perang pumapasok sa drawer mo araw araw.  kung di ka maayos, ikatutuwa mo ito and you will just join the fun anyway everyone's doing it. may boss akong ganyan ang nangyari, nanggaling sa customs, hindi kinaya ng kunsensya nagresign after 2 years.


bajoyjoy

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^Maybe you should seek time to read the SSS reports (you can download it in their website -- I did it).

SSS reported more than 900,000 employers.  There are less than 200,000 recalcitrant employers (did not submit or deficient in their contributions).  SSS filed less than 5,000 cases only.   Remind you, both MERALCO at SSS may kulong ang parusa sa non-payment.

Paano naman tataas ang collection efficiency kung hindi naghahabol?

Remember that SSS employees are GOVERNMENT run and their benefits are GSIS-based.  Ganda di ba?
i'm not really that interested in sss kasi nga gsis member ako hehehe.

anyway, i understand. and also sss members themselves should report and file their complaint para mas mabilit madetect na hindi nagbabayad...

again, hindi GSIS pension ang motivators ng SSS employees. even while they are working, ineenjoy na nila ng husto ang sss fund with their high salaries and various benefits. lahat sila halos de-kotse kahit secretary or clerk.

Mahiya naman si De Quiros ( tama ba name nya) and his admin, lahat na sila working there!
And why should they get a bonus kung maganda ang income ng investments, that fund is a TRUST FUND. MANAGERS lang sila na may fixed fee/salary. WHY, pag lugi ba sa bear market, babayaran nila ang losses?

Yan ang dapat baguhin but does Noy even understands this?
ang hirit ng mga yan (de quiros), maliit pa yan! icompare nyo sa sweldo ko from the private sector, nag-pay cut na nga ako nyan e! SSS president or bank president, anlaki ng agwat sa bonus nyan ha?! wala nang ibang tatanggap ng trabahong ito na di ka lang magpapay-cut, makukulong ka pa (admin and crim case) kung may malaki kang pagkakamali! nagsakripisyo ko, Para sa bayan!  :harhar: :hihi: :applause:

its not noy who should understand but the lawmakers. pnoy only executes the law in place kahit mali-mali.


DreamWalker

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^ Oh I am sorry you are not familiar with an audit procedure.   How do you measure collection efficiency?  SSS reported those numbers (32.5 million members)

from what i know once nag work ka sa private sector sop na yang sss number, and auto deduct na yan once na employ ka.  sa pagkaka alam ko din ay by quarter ang remit ng employer sa sss. masasabi ko na mataas ang collection effeciency nila sa contributions but sa loan collections nila maaring mas mabababa kasi kung hindi dumaan sa HR ang tseke mo or hindi mo sinabi sa accounting niyo na may loan ka hindi ka nila kakaltasan. dito nagkaka problema kasi tumutubo ung loan mo pero wala ka bayad then magbibigay sila ng loan condonation na konti lang babayaran mo interest para lang bumalik sa kanila ung na loan mo na pera. loan condonation ang lagi hinihintay ng mga delinguent na loaner sa sss. kung papatupad naman nila na bayaran mo lahat kawawa din naman ung nag loan pero by right dapat naman magbayad talaga ang tao ng principal + interest. kung ipatutupad naman nila na strikto at waalng loan condonation tiyak madami na naman magra rally niyan sa edsa

i found this article while searching for sss effeciency, if you read it objectively logical din naman ung numbers na sinabi nila. hindi lang kapani paniwala ung sinabi ni colmenares na % ng collection kasi nga accounting dept ng company ung humahawak ng sss contributions and nare remit un by bulk. saka kahit saan form ngayon required na ang sss at gsis number ng tao, so kahit hindi ka magbayad o lulubog lilitaw ka ng bayad consider ka pa rin na member. kung itiwalag ka naman tyak reklamo sasabihin san pupunta ung na contribute ng tao.

http://www.mb.com.ph/sss-debunks-low-collection-efficiency-allegation/


wilch23

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i'm not really that interested in sss kasi nga gsis member ako hehehe.

anyway, i understand. and also sss members themselves should report and file their complaint para mas mabilit madetect na hindi nagbabayad...

again, hindi GSIS pension ang motivators ng SSS employees. even while they are working, ineenjoy na nila ng husto ang sss fund with their high salaries and various benefits. lahat sila halos de-kotse kahit secretary or clerk.
ang hirit ng mga yan (de quiros), maliit pa yan! icompare nyo sa sweldo ko from the private sector, nag-pay cut na nga ako nyan e! SSS president or bank president, anlaki ng agwat sa bonus nyan ha?! wala nang ibang tatanggap ng trabahong ito na di ka lang magpapay-cut, makukulong ka pa (admin and crim case) kung may malaki kang pagkakamali! nagsakripisyo ko, Para sa bayan!  :harhar: :hihi: :applause:

its not noy who should understand but the lawmakers. pnoy only executes the law in place kahit mali-mali.

Why not NOy? Dba the Executive Dept ang nagbibigay ng bonus and salary scale / scheme nila, after their proposal, congress then approves, disapproves or make some changes. The REAL INITIATOR is still the EXECUTIVE headed by Noy


wilch23

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from what i know once nag work ka sa private sector sop na yang sss number, and auto deduct na yan once na employ ka.  sa pagkaka alam ko din ay by quarter ang remit ng employer sa sss. masasabi ko na mataas ang collection effeciency nila sa contributions but sa loan collections nila maaring mas mabababa kasi kung hindi dumaan sa HR ang tseke mo or hindi mo sinabi sa accounting niyo na may loan ka hindi ka nila kakaltasan. dito nagkaka problema kasi tumutubo ung loan mo pero wala ka bayad then magbibigay sila ng loan condonation na konti lang babayaran mo interest para lang bumalik sa kanila ung na loan mo na pera. loan condonation ang lagi hinihintay ng mga delinguent na loaner sa sss. kung papatupad naman nila na bayaran mo lahat kawawa din naman ung nag loan pero by right dapat naman magbayad talaga ang tao ng principal + interest. kung ipatutupad naman nila na strikto at waalng loan condonation tiyak madami na naman magra rally niyan sa edsa

i found this article while searching for sss effeciency, if you read it objectively logical din naman ung numbers na sinabi nila. hindi lang kapani paniwala ung sinabi ni colmenares na % ng collection kasi nga accounting dept ng company ung humahawak ng sss contributions and nare remit un by bulk. saka kahit saan form ngayon required na ang sss at gsis number ng tao, so kahit hindi ka magbayad o lulubog lilitaw ka ng bayad consider ka pa rin na member. kung itiwalag ka naman tyak reklamo sasabihin san pupunta ung na contribute ng tao.

http://www.mb.com.ph/sss-debunks-low-collection-efficiency-allegation/

What you are saying is that the employer auto collects from the employees (SSS members) kaya walang kawala ang SSS member. Pero what happens to the collection? Maraming company hindi nag reremit nito sa SSS mismo, for a variety of reasons. This is the COLLECTION EFFICIENCY problem na sinasabi nila which really NEEDS improvement.

Re LOAN payment collection, iba eto. This is more of loss of income for SSS.
Eto basic setup ng SSS.
1. SSS collect membership dues thru the private employers, wherein the companies contribute more than the members. So automatically lamang ang members kahit ibalik lang ang hulog credited to him sa SSS.
2. From the dues, SSS will provide for pension, death and other benefits with corresponding rates/ terms and conditions.
There will also be operating expense, which should be taken from the dues, NOT from the EARNINGS of the SSS TRUST FUND.
3. To pay for no.2 above, the collected fund will need to earn and grow. How?
Thru all sorts of loan to members or other people.
By investing part of the fund in Real Estate, Stocks and others.

As to which figures are accurate, ewan ko na.
Pa EXTERNAL AUDIT, para malaman.
Sa sweldo and other operating expense, dapat 5% or less only based on collection of dues. They have no right to the trust fund and its earnings.


bajoyjoy

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Why not NOy? Dba the Executive Dept ang nagbibigay ng bonus and salary scale / scheme nila, after their proposal, congress then approves, disapproves or make some changes. The REAL INITIATOR is still the EXECUTIVE headed by Noy
no.

as a govt corporation (not sure if its a GFI or GOCC), the sss law (their charter) gives the sss board the power to approve bonuses, etc. they need not go up to pnoy. self-serving, obviously. the way to correct this is for lawmakers to amend SSS law/charter and bawasan ang discretion nila sa mga monetary benefits. i also dont know if covered ang sss sa mga GOCCs na rquired magpa-approve sa governance commission ng mga ganyan, parang 3 years ago pa lang nabuo yang commission kasi saka "performance-based incentives" lang yata ang nireregulate, sori di rin ako updated... at kung covered sila ito, may nadeny na ba sa mga pinropose nila kasi nga lagi naman pag fiscal autonomy ng chartered agency ang ininvoke nila, lusot na. sa coa na ang next na level na mag-audit kung sobra na sila..




« Last Edit: Jan 30, 2016, 02:30 PM by bajoyjoy »


wilch23

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Hmmm.... ok, BUT,and a big BUT si NOy pa rin ang BOSS nila.
He can order them not to give the bonus or to limit it to a certain amount.
Sino b nag appoint a SSS executives.
Kung considered GOCC then under pa rin sa EXEC Dept.
As in Mamasapano, the Pres is ultimately the one responsible.
Kung hindi nya ma-control, mahina ang management skills and control nya.
Well, we already know that pala.

Bawal din pass the buck to COA.
An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.
« Last Edit: Jan 30, 2016, 08:15 PM by wilch23 »


bauer

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                                                     Malaysia retirement fund        GSIS fund                           SSS fund
         
total contribution                                   53,754,528.00             83,681,317,310.00     120,650,000,000.00
contribution withdrawals                           35,467,747.00             83,275,403,441.00     102,598,000,000.00
Net investible amount                           18,286,781.00                  405,913,869.00       18,052,000,000.00
% investible to contribution                       34.02%                         0.485%                              14.96%
         
Gross investment income                   40,972,720.00             48,323,000,000.00        34,530,000,000.00
Operating expenditure                             2,272,406.00               7,510,000,000.00          8,113,000,000.00
% operating to gross investment                      6%                                       16%                                23%

2013 divident credited to members     35,467,747.00       

What can we know from figures presented herein:

Malaysia is well managed compared to GSIS & SSS because there is a 34% available excess for investment.

Malaysia has the lowest expense ratio on investment income while we see that GSIS reports a lower expense than SSS, we should take note that GSIS members based are 1.5 million ONLY while SSS has 32.5 million members.  In effect, on a per member basis, GSIS spends a lot of money.

Malaysia has a better retirement plan because Malaysia credits a huge amount to EACH MEMBER'S ACCOUNT in a form of dividends a feature not present in either SSS or GSIS.


bauer

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Now we know the facts on SSS

We overpaid the officers and employees.  23% of investment income were spent as operating expense.

A huge collection deficiency of more than 50%.

Very low retirement income unlike its counterpart in government --- GSIS and AFP-PNP pension

Next what are the proposed solutions to STOP the injustices and restore the fund to good health? 


jenofstructures

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no.

as a govt corporation (not sure if its a GFI or GOCC), the sss law (their charter) gives the sss board the power to approve bonuses, etc. they need not go up to pnoy. self-serving, obviously. the way to correct this is for lawmakers to amend SSS law/charter and bawasan ang discretion nila sa mga monetary benefits. i also dont know if covered ang sss sa mga GOCCs na rquired magpa-approve sa governance commission ng mga ganyan, parang 3 years ago pa lang nabuo yang commission kasi saka "performance-based incentives" lang yata ang nireregulate, sori di rin ako updated... at kung covered sila ito, may nadeny na ba sa mga pinropose nila kasi nga lagi naman pag fiscal autonomy ng chartered agency ang ininvoke nila, lusot na. sa coa na ang next na level na mag-audit kung sobra na sila..


Curiosity lang, pwede ko ba malaman kung magkano minimum na binabayad sa GSIS ng mga empleyado, I mean kahit yung sa mga mababang ranking?

Mahirap kasi maging basehan ang percentage base sa sahod e. Iniisip ko, malaki ang percentage na kinukuha sa members ng GSIS pero mas mababa naman ang sahod nila.



DreamWalker

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Now we know the facts on SSS

We overpaid the officers and employees.  23% of investment income were spent as operating expense.

A huge collection deficiency of more than 50%.

Very low retirement income unlike its counterpart in government --- GSIS and AFP-PNP pension

Next what are the proposed solutions to STOP the injustices and restore the fund to good health? 

we can all propose/suggest but in the end ano? we can compare apple 1 apple 2 apple 3 ng iba ibang bansa but in the end ano? in the end sasakit lang ang ulo mo, tataas lang ang blood pressure mo, mapapagod lang tayo sa kaka research ng data ng mga apple

madami tayong maiisip na dapat gawin ng sss kasi hindi tayo ang naka upo, parang contestant lang yan sa tv ung mga nanonood alam kung ano ang sagot at sasabihin bobo ung nasa tv pero alam ba natin kung ano ang nasa ganong sitwasyon?

madami tayong maiisip na puwede gawin sa sss na siguradong hindi maipapatupad ng sss kasi hindi naman tayo ang andon, pero tayo naka isip na ba ng gagawin para umunlad ang sarili at wag umasa sa sss? magaling ang iba mag suggest pero sila ba nakapag suggest ng dapat baguhin sa sarili nila? alam naman natin kung magkano ang magiging pension at alam natin na hindi sasapat un sa pagtanda pero bakit hindi tayo gumawa ng hakbang para hindi lang don manggagaling ang pinansiyal sa pagtanda.

logically kung 11% lang na contribution ang binibigay mo sa sss monthly, minsan puto putol pa dapat sa pagtanda mo huwag ka umasa na 100% ng pera mo or ikabubuhay mo ay don manggagaling. meron kang 40+ years na maghulog sa sss at meron ka din 40+ years na mag ipon at maghanda para sa pagtanda mo

para sa akin pabor din ako dyan sa 2000 na increase kasi nanay at tatay ko me pension na, hindi sila minimum na pension kasi nong mawalan ng trabaho ay nag contribute pa din sila and ung pambayad sa sss ang itinatabi nila bago ang lahat, ung iba kasi pinag iinom/sugal/sigarilyo/luho pa.



bauer

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^ Parang may malalim kang pinaghuhugutan ah.  Easy. Relax lang.

I am sharing my thoughts in this thread using research and analysis so that the discussion can be done in a mature and intelligent level that reduces highly provocative emotional reaction and personal attacks (kasi hindi na makakuha ng mas magandang katwiran).

In post grad studies there are tons of actual cases (business cases in my case) that were being research and analyze so that students can learn how to avoid or minimize the negative impacts on such cases when they applied it in real life.

Now, in case of SSS, I believe we operate in a democratic society and it implies that the public can share their thoughts openly without fear of being jailed.  When our Congress makes laws, the public is invited to share information and views in order to make a good policy.  Democracy needs debates and opinions from all angles.  If public funds are on the line, it is the responsibility of all CITIZENS to guard the funds against all cheaters and grafters.

Kung ikaw ay nag iipon at inilalagak mo ang iyong ipon sa bangko, hindi ba marapat na alamin mo ang kalagayan at katayuan kung paano pinapatakbo ang bangko?  Ganyan rin dapat tayo sa SSS -- dapat natin sitahin, bantayan, at silipin kung paano ginagasta at iniipon ang pondo na pinagkatiwala ng bayan.

Bakit ka nagtrabaho sa ibang bansa?  Kasi konti ang oportunidad dito sa atin.  Pinili ko na maiwan at mamalagi sa ating bayan kahit na may mas magandang buhay sa ibang bansa kasi gusto ko tumulong kahit sa maliit na paraan para maimulat ang kaisipan ng iba nating kababayan na walang oportunidad tulad mo lisanin ang bayan.

Tayong dalawa ay maswerte dahil may kakayahan at kaisipan na umunlad sa ibang bansa.  Pinili mo umalis at umasenso sa ibang bansa.  Pinili ko naman na sumugal dito sa ating bayan at pilitin na dito umasenso kahit na napakaraming suliranin ng ating bayan. 

Kung Makita ko na gumaganda ang kalagayan ng ating bayan --- patuloy pa rin ako na punahin at mag alok ng tamang paraan para maisa-ayos ang mga palakad.  Hindi ko iisipin na pansarili lang ang dapat na aking obligasyon.  Patriotismo ang lubos na kulang sa henerasyon ngayon.


jmces

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please keep on posting your thoughts on this. It is true that we can say anything we want, opinions, facts or whatever. This may not help solve the issue as it is not controlled by us. But one thing I am sure, whenever someone posts data or argument inside this thread another newbie, lurker or even a regular member that is not aware of what is really happening will be enlightened, or somehow become curious. Most of the members here will not depend on SSS alone, but it is not a reason that we do not need to post our thoughts on this. There are a lot of beginners, financially illiterate visitors and newly signed up members that are reading these threads day in and day out, seeking for guidance, finding facts, and some maybe following this discussion as they may find it useful. There is a reason why this thing is called a forum after all.


wilch23

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There seems to be 2 main ideas re our SSS:

1. That the SSS should give us a reasonable amount of pension upon our retirement, ergo the proposed 2000/mo pension increase should be implemented.

2. That we should expect our pension to be commensurate with what we have contributed (including the employer share and earnings) only. That's why the GSIS members get more.

Should the govt subsidize the SSS, it would mean we'll get more than what we contributed (and the earnings).

If only the SSS is run more efficiently, then we'll get more also.
Impossible Dream?


wilch23

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One thing is certain, a retired person cannot survive on his SSS pension alone.


TulogSaPancitan

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this system could still be improved – in terms of collection and rationalizing the benefits and prevent (if not minimize) wastage. all this boils down to improvement in management.

prior to increasing benefits and increasing future contribution, efficiency in management should be implemented first (applicable ba ng iso dito?) para di naman masayang ang contribution.

my personal position is that, any benefit increase should be justified and reviewed thoroughly. if possible public consultation should be done, not just decided by some bloated whales (congressmen) with tiny brains.


darthjuday

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One thing is certain, a retired person cannot survive on his SSS pension alone.

Yeah! Nor will the living benefits cover for the entire needs of a member, i.e. maternity and sickness benefits, personal or calamity loans.

You can complain all you want about how it is being and should be run, but the system will never change, it is entrenched together with our government politics.

In the end, do not forget to take care of yourself and your family.

And to answer to the thread question - 

SSS, do not expect much, it is only meant to augment or alleviate and not to completely support your future needs.
« Last Edit: Feb 03, 2016, 08:03 AM by darthjuday »


bajoyjoy

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Curiosity lang, pwede ko ba malaman kung magkano minimum na binabayad sa GSIS ng mga empleyado, I mean kahit yung sa mga mababang ranking?

Mahirap kasi maging basehan ang percentage base sa sahod e. Iniisip ko, malaki ang percentage na kinukuha sa members ng GSIS pero mas mababa naman ang sahod nila.


from what i've gathered,

Lowest salary in existing govt salary structure is P9,000.

Per GSIS website:
member contribution is 2% (life) + 7% (retirement), so that’s 810 per month.
Agency contribution is 2% (life) + 10% (retirement), so that’s 1080 per month.

Total contribution 1,890 per month


bajoyjoy

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please keep on posting your thoughts on this. It is true that we can say anything we want, opinions, facts or whatever. This may not help solve the issue as it is not controlled by us. But one thing I am sure, whenever someone posts data or argument inside this thread another newbie, lurker or even a regular member that is not aware of what is really happening will be enlightened, or somehow become curious. Most of the members here will not depend on SSS alone, but it is not a reason that we do not need to post our thoughts on this. There are a lot of beginners, financially illiterate visitors and newly signed up members that are reading these threads day in and day out, seeking for guidance, finding facts, and some maybe following this discussion as they may find it useful. There is a reason why this thing is called a forum after all.

That's the intention.


 


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