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Why choose or not choose Union Bank's best uitf fund?

mdejess · 15 · 5553

mdejess

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Let us imagine that an investor is the most aggressive and with big money to invest and he wants big quick return.

According to the performance of uitf funds for the first quarter of 2013, Union Bank's Large Capitalization Philippine Equity Portfolio is the quickest and most productive.
http://www.pinoymoneytalk.com/uitf-earnings-returns-1st-quarter-2013/

So, what are we waiting for, put all our excess idle fund in it?



Mdejess


personalfinanceapprentice

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Reply #1 on: May 02, 2013, 01:40 PM
Well, I'm not an expert but I'll try to share my thoughts:

1:Big return = looks like it fits the criteria, since it's very profitable in Q1. However, I've heard of a fund (and I think It's Union Bank's) that has different prices: They use Bid price when redeeming, but Ask price when showing gains. Is this correct? Haven't had actual dealings with the bank, so I'm not sure.

2. Quick return = The one with the shortest holding period is the one that can give the quickest returns. Not sure how long union bank's holding period is.

If you really want big, quick returns, and you're really aggressive... I've heard that forex would be well-suited for such an investor. But that entails a lot of knowledge and some time to really monitor your investment.

If we're confining ourselves to stocks, the way to get the biggest, quickest returns is to pick stocks through technical analysis. From what I hear it can be a mixed bag, depending on how skilled/knowledgeable/experienced you are. Plus it would also require time to monitor your investment.

If it's a fund we're looking for, then Union bank or the other high performing funds would be ok. When i did a casual comparison of some well-known UITFs and Mutual funds, BDO's came up on top.


...I don't work for BDO, btw. And i didn't invest in their fund, or plan to. Didn't invest with Union Bank either.

« Last Edit: May 02, 2013, 01:42 PM by personalfinanceapprentice »


kiriyama

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Reply #2 on: May 02, 2013, 01:53 PM
actually kaka punta ko lng sa union bank around 15 min. ago para mag bukas ng large cap investment....nag ka problema lng ako sa ID kasi need nila ng ID na malapit sa Branch of choice or proof of billing...kaso dala ko is passport and TIN id...na ang nakasulat ay home address ko na malayo sa branch na un...

eniwei tingin ko maganda tlga 2ng invetment na 2...kasi for the past years very good ang performance nila....

2012: 47.89% YTD
2011: -1.25% YTD medyo loser ang year na 2 sa knila...pero kung e-compare sa ibang MF or UITF almost same lng...kasi ung iba 2% lng to 5% lng that year so close enough..

2010: 109.32% YTD e2 ung bongga...walang palag kahit anung UITF and MF d2.....hehehe

kaya tingin ko ok 2...medyo aggresive lng tlga...kpag bagsak sobrang bagsak...pero kapag up sobrang up din...so it's your choice guy's...pero sa opinion ko d2 nlng tyo kung kaya ng budget...medyo malaki pla initial deposit d2....100k po...




mdejess

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Reply #3 on: May 03, 2013, 09:45 AM
I am myself thinking of switching from BDO to Union Bank's Large Capitalization Philippine Equity Portfolio, because in the bigger picture whatever other negative factors Union Bank still comes forth in uitf funds as the quickest and biggest producer.

But there is something worth thinking and researching about, namely, why people do not all go to Union Bank; is it because of brand loyalty, like some people will definitely stick with McDo instead of Jollibee in regard to burger?

On the other hand, with uitf funds we are dealing with money, which is for our existence in society like blood in respect to our existence as living entities even were there no society where we actually live in.

I have actually switched from BPI to BDO, even though all my banking years in effect I had been exclusively living with BPI.

No, no loyalty to BPI when it is about money, because money is blood in society as blood is life in my biology.

Why have I not switched to Union Bank?

I will as soon as I get enough feedbacks from people who have moved to Union Bank, and these feedbacks convince me that it is more profitable to switch to Union Bank, period.




Mdejess


angeljme

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Reply #4 on: May 03, 2013, 11:49 AM
^--- one major reason is the 100K initial investment... most people who knows a lot about investing would rather go to stock market or forex and pick the stocks themselves

thos who are now only learning about investment, tends to go to those that has very low investment opening... just enough to get your feet wet, as the saying goes

another major factor is that there's very few Unionbank branches and if they're discriminating with that address proximity policy, it's a backfire too


personalfinanceapprentice

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Reply #5 on: May 03, 2013, 02:02 PM
^ my thoughts exactly

it does sound like a profitable fund.

Mdejess, when you transfer, could you give us some feedback?

thanks


Sans

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Reply #6 on: May 03, 2013, 10:47 PM
Past performance is NOT a guarantee of future returns. A certain fund may be the best performing this year, but it may become the worst performer next year.

Choose your investment based on the lowest management fees and level of trust you have in the fund manager/institution.


BI

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Reply #7 on: May 04, 2013, 03:59 AM
 Union Bank's Large Capitalization Philippine Equity Portfolio

I have invested in  IFDLCPE (It's symbol name on BLOOMBEG) since Feb. this year. How I wish I did it earlier. My portfolio grew close to 12% to date. Not bad at all. If I started since Jan. 2, my portfolio should have grown by 28.39%- its year to date performance. The best in the UITF category.

To help clarify the BID/OFFER/MID-LAST format on the buying and selling of your fund, let me share with you what I learned from what the person who is in charge with the bank's TRUST dept.

He said that the system is designed this way because the 2% TRUST fee is IMBEDDED on the BID price when you sell. The IFDLCPE doesn't charge you the 2% one time Trust Fees upfront nor at the termination of the portfolio as some UITFs and Mutual Funds do (BPI charge you the 1% at the onset: you pay the 1% over the counter for the fee). In short, when you sell (BID), the price is much lower than the OFFER (buying) price and MID/LAST (closing price for the day) because it contains the 2% TRUST FEE already.

So the whole time that you have invested, you will not be charged by any fee at the onset nor at the end but its already part of the BID price. So all the money that you invest is converted to the # of units you bought.

Example:
Buying (OFFER)
Capital:       100,000.00
Offer:                 774.730607 (April 25,2013)
# of Units:          129.07713

Then I decided to sell my portfolio yesterday (May 2, 2013)
Selling (BID)
Bid:                         778.338797
# of units:               129.07713
Total Amount:  100,465.7348

To compute: (778.338797 x 129.07713 = 100,465.7348)
to get your gain, 100,465.7348 - 100,000.00 = 465.73

In 4 days, you gained Php465.73

Tho this is not an actual thing and nevertheless, impractical thing to do but just for illustrations sake. Another this is that it has a 90 days holding period and with an early redemption fee of .025% or 500 or whichever is higher.

More info on Unionbank's Large Cap Equity Fund...


Here is the information about the: http://www.unionbankph.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=975&Itemid=70

Here is its historical Data:
http://www.unionbankph.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1124&Itemid=70

You can check the chart and performance here: http://www.bloomberg.com/quote/IFDLCPE:PM

Hope this helps a bit. Thank you.


kiriyama

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Reply #8 on: May 04, 2013, 09:11 AM
Union Bank's Large Capitalization Philippine Equity Portfolio

I have invested in  IFDLCPE (It's symbol name on BLOOMBEG) since Feb. this year. How I wish I did it earlier. My portfolio grew close to 12% to date. Not bad at all. If I started since Jan. 2, my portfolio should have grown by 28.39%- its year to date performance. The best in the UITF category.

Example:
Buying (OFFER)
Capital:       100,000.00
Offer:                 774.730607 (April 25,2013)
# of Units:          129.07713

Then I decided to sell my portfolio yesterday (May 2, 2013)
Selling (BID)
Bid:                         778.338797
# of units:               129.07713
Total Amount:  100,465.7348

To compute: (778.338797 x 129.07713 = 100,465.7348)
to get your gain, 100,465.7348 - 100,000.00 = 465.73



Sir medyo naguluhan lng po ako...e2 po ung computation ko based sa sample:


Example:
Buying (OFFER)
Capital:       100,000.00
Offer:                 632.556041 (Jan 2,2013)
to get the number of unit: 100,000 / 632.556041 = 158.0887675
# of Units:          158.0887675

Then I decided to sell my portfolio (May 2, 2013)
Selling (BID)
Bid:                         778.338797
# of units:               158.0887675
Total Amount:  123,046.621115

To compute: (778.338797 x 158.0887675 = 123,046.621115)
to get your gain, 123,046.621115 - 100,000.00 = 23,046.62


Tama po ba ung computation ko? so ung NET result or gains or income is 23,046.62 or 23.04%?


i'm not into any argument or something...just want to clarify...bka ung 28.39% is gross un siguro...


mdejess

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Reply #9 on: May 04, 2013, 01:48 PM
^ my thoughts exactly

it does sound like a profitable fund.

Mdejess, when you transfer, could you give us some feedback?

thanks


Here is the web page of Union Bank on its Large Cap Philippine Equity Portfolio uitf fund.

Quote
Large Capitalization Philippine Equity Portfolio's strategy is to approximate the returns of the PHISIX index while adding value through active stock selection. Its core investment components are large capitalization stocks of the PHISIX. Relative weights between PHISIX stocks as well as opportunistic allocation into non-index issues (e.g. IPO's) may vary from time to time depending on the investment manager's outlook on stock valuations. Research plays a central role in the development of stock valuation views of the investment manager. iFund Large Cap is ideal for investors with a long-term investment horizon seeking capital growth.

Launch Date:   March 1, 2005
Currency of Participation:   Philippine Peso
Minimum Investment:   PHP100,000.00
Return Objective:   To achieve long-term capital growth by investing in a diversified portfolio of high-quality, large capitalization stocks with above-average earnings potential while maintaining a risk profile similar to the PHISIX
Risk Parameters:   1. Market Risk - HIGH
- Proper diversification strategies are utilized to minimize the effects of adverse movements in market prices.
- Value-at-Risk limit: 7.00% in 1 day within 99% Confidence Level

Market Risk - Stock prices are highly volatile and can be affected not just by the company’s performance but also by other factors such as the country’s economic climate, political conditions and acts of nature.

Value-at-Risk (VaR) – is an estimate of the magnitude of loss that a portfolio can experience within a given period of time under certain probability assumptions, or confidence level. For example, a portfolio VaR of 5% within 1 day under a 99% confidence level means that there is 99% certainty that the maximum possible loss a portfolio can experience in 1 day is 5% of its value. Said in the reverse, portfolio losses greater than 5% of its value in 1 day are possible, but the probability of such occurrence is less than 1%.

VaR is often used as a risk measurement tool in portfolio management. The VaR of a portfolio varies depending on the kinds of assets put into the portfolio and their correlation to each other. Portfolios with lowly-correlated assets (i.e. diversified portfolio) tend to have a lower VaR than portfolios with highly-correlated assets. Examples of assets with a traditionally low correlation to each other are stocks and bonds – i.e. when stock prices increase, bond prices normally decrease and vise versa.

Confidence Level – is a statistical range with a specified probability that a given parameter lies within the range. It is a range constructed from sample data (i.e. past observations). A 99% confidence level gives 99% certainty that values would fall within the specified range.

Liquidity:   To ensure adequate liquidity to meet daily fund withdrawals, at least 25% of investments will be in highly liquid instruments
Initial NAV per unit:   PHP 100.00
Time Horizon:   Designed for investors with a long-term investment horizon
- 90 day minimum holding period
- Early redemption fee of 0.25% flat on redeemed amount or PHP500, whichever is higher

Regulatory:   Subject to Bangko Sentral ng Pilipinas regulations governing the creation, administration and investments of Unit Investment Trust Funds as outlined in BSP Circular 447 Series of 2004 and Section UX410 of the Manual of Regulations for Banks.
Valuation Method:   Mark-to-market value of the Fund revalued daily less fees and applicable taxes
Acceptance & Withdrawal Procedure:   Investments into the fund may be accepted on any banking day, at the prevailing NAV per unit. All investments and withdrawals should be processed before 12 noon. Withdrawals will be funded four (4) banking days after the date of transaction.
Withdrawal Procedure:   Withdrawals will be funded four (4) banking days from the date of transaction.
Trust Fees:   2% p.a. based on the total market value of the fund.
 

http://www.unionbankph.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=975&Itemid=72


That is what every uitf fund operators are saying, essentially, if you have read enough of their most productive equity funds.

Nothing frightening about it.

I think what we should find out is how many investors are sticking with them in the Large Cap and are there still more moving to it -- and the reason is because they make more money with the Union Bank's Large Cap, from experience of course, than with other funds from other operators.


No, I am not any agent recruiting for Union Bank and getting paid by the number of new investors.

I am after getting convincing feedbacks from happy investors who are happy because they have made more money with Union's Large Cap than with any other uitf funds from any other operators.

I am talking about uitf funds which have to do with investors leaving to trustees operators to do the work for them, instead of they themselves doing the work for themselves.

That for me is the better way to make money earn for myself.



Mdejess


BI

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Reply #10 on: May 04, 2013, 10:36 PM
Kiriyama, tama yung computation mo at tama din yung computation ko. :)

I did a mistake by writing Jan. 2 as an example but what I used in the example was April 25, 2013. That's why I said in for days only. :)

If I did place the Jan. 2 data, it would be like yours as well. :)

Thanks for clarifying.


personalfinanceapprentice

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Reply #11 on: May 07, 2013, 01:20 PM
(BPI charge you the 1% at the onset: you pay the 1% over the counter for the fee).

So the whole time that you have invested, you will not be charged by any fee at the onset nor at the end but its already part of the BID price. So all the money that you invest is converted to the # of units you bought.


Not to nitpick, but I just want to point out a few things:

A uitf or MF that does not charge an upfront sales load will always convert 100% of your money to shares. Exception is when your remaining money is not enough to buy 1 share, in which case it will be returned to you.

If I have 1000 and each share costs 0.99 then I will have 1010 shares and Php0.1 will be given back to me.


I have invested in 6 different funds from BPI (short term/money market fund, peso bond fund, BPI Equity value fund, Odyssey equity fund, Odyssey high-conviction fund, and ALFM Philippine Stock index fund). In none of those funds did I get charged 1% at the onset. And in all cases my money was converted to shares or given back to me.


Also, I would like to point out that uitf and MF that charge management fees do so by incorporating it into the NAVPU. The NAVPU is net of taxes, fees, and everything else you might have to pay.

If Union Bank quotes a NAVPU (based on ASK price) that does not include fees (which is "buit-in" to the BID price), then their perfomance quote is a little misleading. All the other funds already subtracted the 1-2% management fee before quoting performance.

And based on your explanation of the BID price it's just a sneaky form of back-end sales load.

Would you know if the BID price is always a certain percentage lower than the ASK price? like 2%?


mdejess

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Reply #12 on: May 08, 2013, 05:47 AM
That is what I read also in the net from people who talk about funds operators, they mention the tricky UnionBank's practice of Ask price and Bid price, to enhance their productivity but at the expense of their investors clients.


Have you folks noticed that Bpi is not among the top performers?

Bpi seems to prefer just being trusted by its clients although not winning in the p.r. contest.

Yes, that is what I get from everyone's feedbacks, from folks dealing with banks and also banks funds operators: with Bpi you can sleep soundly and not be worrying whether your banks or funds operators are exploiting you, or getting overly greedy and lapsing into high risks at your expense.

So, I address the question to myself and everyone here, can we trust Bdo better or as well as we trust Bpi? What about UnionBank?

Common wisdom tells us that it is better we have peace of mind than always being lured by greed and not being able to sleep soundly everytime the financial world even just sneezes.

What about Bdo, is it already too big to flop for being one of the SM group of companies, even though among the biggest banks, it is the newest kid on the block and with the briefest history?


If you ask me, for myself I divide my money between Bpi and Bdo: Bpi for peace of mind and Bdo for more money.




Mdejess


mdejess

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Reply #13 on: May 01, 2014, 06:02 AM
If only we can get to know how many investors have put how much of their money into what funds with what fund operators, then we can at least guide ourselves, namely, to put our money where a lot of folks like ourselves do, that is the idea of safety in number -- of course it does not always work out to be safe, because humans are most likable to follow the herd blindly.

So, follow the number but don't act without critical intelligence.

Sorry, guys here, I have not yet moved my money to Union Bank, because I am apprehensive of having to haul or drag my money from one operator to another one, and I fear that I might also get in trouble for being too greedy, as onetime head of Neda, Mr. Neri, said, "Moderate your greed."

If you are making good money already, prefer peace of mind and relaxation in place of dragging your money all over town to put it in what appears to be the most productive of funds at the latest survey.

But it is a good and absorbing study.



Mdejess



triggerbokie

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Reply #14 on: Jun 17, 2014, 11:37 AM
i invested some funds into this account recently.
one thing i saw in comparison to bdo and bpi equity uitfs is that the latter 2's
portfolio is mostly holding companies (around 20+%) compared to unionbanks
40+% of food, staples and retailing.

that's just my take.


 


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